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    Given a choice

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    Violet
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    Given a choice

    Post  Violet on Fri Feb 17, 2012 11:12 pm

    First topic message reminder :

    I'm sure we've all heard of or even know people who have actually died and come back (NDE) some report being given the choice to come back or not, why do some get this choice and not others or do we all get the choice with the majority obviously opting for the otherside, others are told its not their time so they have to come back (so why did they die at all?)


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  mac on Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:58 pm

    [quote="Joanie"]
    mac wrote:
    Joanie wrote:Interesting topic,Violet.
    I think I have related on site before about my husband's NDE.
    Briefly,went on the operating table,his heart stopped and he found himself in a tunnel of beautiful rainbow colours.
    The usual light at the end of the tunnel.
    He drifted slowly up but about half way,he was drawn back.
    He encountered no one up the tunnel.
    One min,he was there and the next,he was in recovery.
    He was very ill during that time,with cancer and heart problems.
    1995 he was diagnosed with those symtoms,he passed in 2006.
    The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?

    "The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?" It wasn't that he had been 'sent back' but it was a situation that the time of his death was not imminent.

    Take a look at my recent posting and see if my ideas have any resonance.
    [/quot

    Yes,I understand Mac.
    So I assume a severe heart attack would give the body a false message that
    death was imminent and send the spirit on it's way but without releasing the silver cord.
    Am I correct?

    Yes, that's kinda what I was suggesting but not so much sending the spirit on its way as the spirit becoming temporarily dissociated from the physical body (as in Astral travelling) and also confused by the sudden truma of the heart attack. (in Ken's case or any severe trauma in others....)

    That's the mac down-to-earth scenario compared with the romantic "wanted to come back to be with you" scenario painted elsewhere. Did Ken have the time to consider the situation in depth, do you think?

    Yer pays yer money and yer choice....

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  SpiritVoices on Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:11 pm

    [quote="mac"]
    Joanie wrote:
    mac wrote:
    Joanie wrote:Interesting topic,Violet.
    I think I have related on site before about my husband's NDE.
    Briefly,went on the operating table,his heart stopped and he found himself in a tunnel of beautiful rainbow colours.
    The usual light at the end of the tunnel.
    He drifted slowly up but about half way,he was drawn back.
    He encountered no one up the tunnel.
    One min,he was there and the next,he was in recovery.
    He was very ill during that time,with cancer and heart problems.
    1995 he was diagnosed with those symtoms,he passed in 2006.
    The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?

    "The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?" It wasn't that he had been 'sent back' but it was a situation that the time of his death was not imminent.

    Take a look at my recent posting and see if my ideas have any resonance.
    [/quot

    Yes,I understand Mac.
    So I assume a severe heart attack would give the body a false message that
    death was imminent and send the spirit on it's way but without releasing the silver cord.
    Am I correct?

    Yes, that's kinda what I was suggesting but not so much sending the spirit on its way as the spirit becoming temporarily dissociated from the physical body (as in Astral travelling) and also confused by the sudden truma of the heart attack. (in Ken's case or any severe trauma in others....)

    That's the mac down-to-earth scenario compared with the romantic "wanted to come back to be with you" scenario painted elsewhere. Did Ken have the time to consider the situation in depth, do you think?

    Yer pays yer money and yer choice....

    He probably couldn't get on his way quickly enough.
    No wonder he was quiet on the way home.
    :giggles:

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Karin on Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:37 pm

    mac wrote:If anyone is "sent back", who would be doing the sending back?

    How would anyone have that authority? Where would the authority come from....?


    Hi Mac,

    some people say, we choose in advance our life with every detail... if that's true so we are the authority to choose about our life or "death".

    In other case the answer could be "God" if you are able to believe that there is a higher force to direct our affairs...

    Just two thoughts, Mac.




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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Karin on Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:46 pm

    Joanie wrote:
    Karin wrote:Hi Joanie, my friend.

    The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?

    Was he sent back or did he want to come back and to be with you? He suffered pain for another 11 years, but he was for another 11 years by your side.

    That's a sign of love, Joanie.




    Karin

    A lovely way of putting it,Karin.
    Strangely enough,he knew 25 years before he passed approximately when his death would occur. He was a year out.


    This confirms my theory! Who wouldn't fight for life to stay by the side of someone he loves? As more as his higher being knew WHEN his death would occur...?

    Don't ask why he had to suffer for such a long time, Joanie. He wanted to be by your side and that's the greatest declaration of love I can imagine.




    Karin xxx

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  mac on Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:52 pm

    Karin wrote:
    mac wrote:If anyone is "sent back", who would be doing the sending back?

    How would anyone have that authority? Where would the authority come from....?


    Hi Mac,

    some people say, we choose in advance our life with every detail... if that's true so we are the authority to choose about our life or "death".

    In other case the answer could be "God" if you are able to believe that there is a higher force to direct our affairs...

    Just two thoughts, Mac.




    Karin

    That's easy enough....

    You may be right that some people believe what you suggest - doesn't necessarily make 'em right though.... People believe all kinds of thing. Of course we made the choice to be here, yes we had hopes and intentions for our lives, but no I wouldn't for one moment accept that every single detail has been unchangingly mapped out by ourselves or on our behalf.

    Of NDEs we might be the one who makes that eventual choice to carry on into the next world or to return to the one we though we were leaving, a choice that's made in the light of the actual situation rather than any pre-ordained one.

    As for God makin' the choice to send us back in such a situation, well perhaps that could be correct too. But my God is a much more impersonal entity and not concerned with the tiny sparks which are of itself, from itself, identically similar to itself but individuated in order to experience lives as single entities before eventually rejoining their source in the distant future.

    So, yeah, some might also believe it's God who sends us back and as I said earlier, folk believe all kinds of stuff.

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  mac on Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:55 pm

    Karin wrote:
    Joanie wrote:
    Karin wrote:Hi Joanie, my friend.

    The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?

    Was he sent back or did he want to come back and to be with you? He suffered pain for another 11 years, but he was for another 11 years by your side.

    That's a sign of love, Joanie.




    Karin

    A lovely way of putting it,Karin.
    Strangely enough,he knew 25 years before he passed approximately when his death would occur. He was a year out.


    This confirms my theory! Who wouldn't fight for life to stay by the side of someone he loves? As more as his higher being knew WHEN his death would occur...?

    Don't ask why he had to suffer for such a long time, Joanie. He wanted to be by your side and that's the greatest declaration of love I can imagine.




    Karin xxx

    Or alternatively if he was correct in his fore-knowledge about how long his life was destined to last, he'd also know that he could not have it shortened - or he wouldn't have been right about it in the first place.... catch 22

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Karin on Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:19 pm

    mac wrote:
    Karin wrote:
    mac wrote:If anyone is "sent back", who would be doing the sending back?

    How would anyone have that authority? Where would the authority come from....?


    Hi Mac,

    some people say, we choose in advance our life with every detail... if that's true so we are the authority to choose about our life or "death".

    In other case the answer could be "God" if you are able to believe that there is a higher force to direct our affairs...

    Just two thoughts, Mac.




    Karin

    That's easy enough....

    You may be right that some people believe what you suggest - doesn't necessarily make 'em right though.... People believe all kinds of thing. Of course we made the choice to be here, yes we had hopes and intentions for our lives, but no I wouldn't for one moment accept that every single detail has been unchangingly mapped out by ourselves or on our behalf.

    Of NDEs we might be the one who makes that eventual choice to carry on into the next world or to return to the one we though we were leaving, a choice that's made in the light of the actual situation rather than any pre-ordained one.

    As for God makin' the choice to send us back in such a situation, well perhaps that could be correct too. But my God is a much more impersonal entity and not concerned with the tiny sparks which are of itself, from itself, identically similar to itself but individuated in order to experience lives as single entities before eventually rejoining their source in the distant future.

    So, yeah, some might also believe it's God who sends us back and as I said earlier, folk believe all kinds of stuff.


    Mac, I just told about two thoughts... and for myself I'm there to say "You are right!" because you say...

    but no I wouldn't for one moment
    accept that every single detail has been unchangingly mapped out by
    ourselves or on our behalf.

    ... because I also think that we always have a choice... and that our way of life is NOT defined in all details.

    But I'm not sure if there isn't really a higher source which makes corrective interventions... If we overdo it.




    Karin - I'm going to watch TV. There's a boxing match... Good Night, folks!

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  mac on Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:23 pm

    "Mac, I just told about two thoughts... and for myself I'm there to say "You are right!" because you say...


    but no I wouldn't for one moment
    accept that every single detail has been unchangingly mapped out by
    ourselves or on our behalf.

    ... because I also think that we always have a choice... and that our way of life is NOT defined in all details.

    But I'm not sure if there isn't really a higher source which makes corrective interventions... If we overdo it."

    By contrast I am comfortable that no 'higher source' will make corrective interventions - at least not in my life!

    And I'm off shortly to sit in the sun....

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  SpiritVoices on Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:49 pm

    mac wrote:
    Karin wrote:
    Joanie wrote:
    Karin wrote:Hi Joanie, my friend.

    The question is....why was he sent back to suffer all the pain which he did for another 11 years?

    Was he sent back or did he want to come back and to be with you? He suffered pain for another 11 years, but he was for another 11 years by your side.

    That's a sign of love, Joanie.




    Karin

    A lovely way of putting it,Karin.
    Strangely enough,he knew 25 years before he passed approximately when his death would occur. He was a year out.


    This confirms my theory! Who wouldn't fight for life to stay by the side of someone he loves? As more as his higher being knew WHEN his death would occur...?

    Don't ask why he had to suffer for such a long time, Joanie. He wanted to be by your side and that's the greatest declaration of love I can imagine.




    Karin xxx

    Or alternatively if he was correct in his fore-knowledge about how long his life was destined to last, he'd also know that he could not have it shortened - or he wouldn't have been right about it in the first place.... catch 22

    You're right on,Mac,why didn't I fathom that out?

    Something I really should have known or realised.

    We were married in 1981,he told me in 1982,he had 25 years left.

    He was out by one year,he passed in 2006.

    Not bad for a prophecy,eh?

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Assumpta on Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:24 pm

    This is a very interesting subject. I myself have experience a NDE it was not long after we moved here to Spain. I tripped over one of our cats and hit my head on the cave wall. I can remember travelling down a bright tunnel/passageway where an even brighter light was at the end. I can remember not feeling at all afraid and quite relaxed. As I got nearer to the end I could see people standing there, the nearer I got the better I could see them when I realised there were my parents, aunts and uncles, I can remember all too clearly a feeling of complete peace come over me when my mothers voice said I was to go back, it wasn't my time.

    Suddenly I heard a screaming noise, which I now know was me coming back into my body and experiencing the pain in my head. It was something I shall never forget and that was when I stopped being afraid of dying.


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  SpiritVoices on Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:37 pm

    Assumpta wrote:This is a very interesting subject. I myself have experience a NDE it was not long after we moved here to Spain. I tripped over one of our cats and hit my head on the cave wall. I can remember travelling down a bright tunnel/passageway where an even brighter light was at the end. I can remember not feeling at all afraid and quite relaxed. As I got nearer to the end I could see people standing there, the nearer I got the better I could see them when I realised there were my parents, aunts and uncles, I can remember all too clearly a feeling of complete peace come over me when my mothers voice said I was to go back, it wasn't my time.

    Suddenly I heard a screaming noise, which I now know was me coming back into my body and experiencing the pain in my head. It was something I shall never forget and that was when I stopped being afraid of dying.


    I never knew that had happened to you,Assumpta.

    You were very lucky!


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Assumpta on Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:33 pm

    I must admit to feeling very priviledged to have experienced this Joan. It's something I shall never forget and hope my parents will be there again to greet me when I pass.


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Beware_of_Italics on Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:33 am

    It's a mystery, Violet. I guess we all have certain "windows" in our life where we have the choice to either stay or go.

    My aunt was one of those people. She had surgery when "911" was happening, and her doctor bailed on her after her surgery... which was botched. She was told - by her grandmother, that she had the choice to either stay or go. She chose to stay for her kids. (Just FYI: When she "died," my mother and I both felt it at the same time. It was the strangest feeling, and neither of us said anything about it until the next day).

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Violet on Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:07 am

    Thanks for sharing Assumpta, like Joanie says you were very lucky.

    when my mothers voice said I was to go back, it wasn't my time.
    This suggests that we do have a set 'time' to go and that acidents do happen and you weren't meant to be there at that time, or were you meant to experience that? Did this event change your life in any way Assumpta, other than making you not afraid of dying?


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Beware_of_Italics on Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:34 am

    What I would also love to know is whether our "time" to pass away is something coming outside of ourselves... from Spirit/God/whatever one is most comfortable calling it... or if our "time" to pass is determined BY US instead? Who's making the big decision here?

    Them, or us?

    I just wonder if we've planned our own deaths before we even come here, or is it all just chance or a plan made for us by God/whomever?

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Violet on Tue Mar 06, 2012 1:35 am

    I think our death date is set before we come here, i've heard of and read about people predicting their own death or knowing what age they'll die.


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  SpiritVoices on Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:09 am

    I believe I have read that too,Violet.

    We are given a number of years to live on the earth plane but once we enter the physical world,that information is forgotten.

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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Violet on Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:37 pm

    Normally yes, makes you wonder why/how some do remember if that is what it is, remembering.


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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Lynn on Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:56 am

    Violet wrote:I'm sure we've all heard of or even know people who have actually died and come back (NDE) some report being given the choice to come back or not, why do some get this choice and not others or do we all get the choice with the majority obviously opting for the otherside, others are told its not their time so they have to come back (so why did they die at all?)



    Hello



    Well having had the NDE event happen in this lifetime I was not really given a choice to go back or stay in Spirit....more mine was a message event. I was not on the best of paths for all that I can do in life....so I was give the message of going back BUT with condtions attached. If I did not change that path of darkenss I was on the NEXT time the death would be real and final. I was sent back too I know from a regression I YELLED out I will not die....that I was not ready for the end to come to me. The path I was on did change now was that so much out of the message I got or the forced down time in healing I was given. I have to feel maybe both.

    Why the experience if we are to only maybe suffer along somemore....well a good friend of mine that has been pronounced "Dead" on several occations now says he comes back to teach the Dr's a bit more....as the next life he is to be a Dr. I have to admire his courge though it all as there are days he does so suffer along that path. He to has had proceedures and studies named in his honour so he is doing his purpose I would have to say.

    Do we all get a choice I have to from what I know from working with Spirits say NO when your TRUE time is up that is that your GONE but never fully forgotten.



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    Re: Given a choice

    Post  Violet on Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:36 pm

    Hi Lynn

    well a good friend of mine that has been pronounced "Dead" on several occations now says he comes back to teach the Dr's a bit more....

    i've often wondered why some seem to die a few times, sometimes in the space of hours and even minutes, before their final death, it seems a bit cruel to drag people back and forth between life and death in this way especially if it is their time to die, to hear it teaches dr's sounds ok but even so a bit harsh on the patient, i'd have thought so anyway.


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