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    Struggling to get past the 'logic'

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    Ronaai
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    Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  Ronaai on Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:53 pm

    I'm afraid I've been raised in a Stephen Hawking family where logic says there isn't anything after death. You shut down and that's all folks, as a kid it never bothered me...death wasn't an understandable topic, so who cares right? Now I'm at the age where I do understand...I've lost countless friends, around my age or younger, to cancer. 

    And I miss them so much...knowing them has opened up my mind and shown me how lucky I really am, one of them faced death so beautifully...she was 100% certain there was something after physical death, I'm not one of those jerks who tries to tear people down. I accept all beliefs, but... I'd secretly hoped if she was right, that they'd send me signs to show they're around...something for me to grasp onto, because now I'm scared. I don't want to become nothing, I don't want to accept I'll become nothing. But the logic side I've been raised with nulls out any hope I'm able to muster; I realise time only applies to humans, we're the only species to understand it's concepts and that's only because we wanted a way to keep track and measure...so in a sense, time doesn't exist but how is it possible for a living organism with only 100 or so years on this planet to contain a spiritual body that is eternal?

    I try watching Medium shows, but I recall quite vividly being told; "Mediums are scam artists of the worst kind. They're not only scamming others, they're also scamming themselves. They're so scared of death they've tricked their mind into believing they really can contact the dead, so when these poor emotionally unstable people come in, they will grasp onto the smallest piece of information even if it's miles from the truth of their loved one, and it's all lies." 

    I've also had it drilled into me that Souls/spirits do not exist, there's nothing inside a person aside brains and organs. The brain controls everything, dead = gone...one uncle believes consciousness is just a myth used to fuel religion, since to him religion = brainwashing power over people. Tell them they're God's real "Science has said God is real!" and you can control them to your whims..."life is meaningless, there is no God and you're dead a long time so live your life cause you only get one." is one of his favourite quotes.

    So I can't take it seriously...now I say "family" not all of my family feel this way thankfully, my mums side is a LOT more open minded, my Nan lost her husband, my Grandfather, when I was very small, my nan has always "spoken" to him, even now in the throws of dementia she still natters away to him, and my mum while accepting the logic, has told me she has heard his voice in her head a few times, mostly when she's scared or doesn't know what to do, so while realising it could just be longing for her dad, she says it does give her hope for more.

    I just don't know what to believe in anymore, everything around me; Science, Religion, Spirituality...it all feels like brainwashing. There are moments where I just want to break down crying.

    I don't want to never see my family again, of all my animals my dog is my absolute world...he can't fill my head with his ideals, just unconditional love; and I want to be with him always, it's not fair how we have these amazing animals, but they only get so long...and my mum, she's my world. We get on like chalk and cheese and I can't imagine a time without her without breaking down in tears, I can't imagine a time without any of my family...sure I don't exactly like their views, but they're my family. I'd be nothing without them.


    My Step-dad, his father "died" before passing away a few days later and apparently had an NDE...of course, that was dismissed as the drugs since another member of my family has a friend who was 'dead' for 20 minutes after a motorbike accident and described it as; "the light just went off. I wasn't there, no bright light, people waiting for me, nothing. The only reason I know it happened was because I woke up." 

    I also have a friend who stopped breathing as a child and remember absolutely nothing...but I don't know all the details about that and since they were so young, they're not 100% sure of it all either and never really wanted to ask about the happenings with their parents...

    So I just don't know anymore, I was hoping I'd be able to find someone to talk to on here...this isn't my first post; I posted about NDE's wondering why some people have them and others don't, but didn't really get much to go on with it. Grateful to those who replied, but I was hoping for a more in depth answer...

    Sorry if this is in the wrong place, it's to do with a fear of death...but I'm not sure if it belongs here or in lost souls. 

    Thank you x
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    ameliorate
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    Re: Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  ameliorate on Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:11 pm

    There is no need to apologise for your post.  You clearly want some answers.  There are those that will address the medium side of things.  All I would say is that not all mediums are charlatans so you have been subject to conditioning into thinking this and it's tantamount to throwing the baby out with the bath water.  There are some real, talented psychic people who have access to information not readily apparent.


    People who are spiritualised have realised that they are more than their ego.  Essentially we are mind, body and spirit.  Our soul/spirit can be experienced through such practises as meditation when we are in touch with our true essence.

    mac
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    Re: Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  mac on Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:45 am

    Ronaai wrote:I'm afraid I've been raised in a Stephen Hawking family where logic says there isn't anything after death. You shut down and that's all folks, as a kid it never bothered me...death wasn't an understandable topic, so who cares right? Now I'm at the age where I do understand...I've lost countless friends, around my age or younger, to cancer. 

    And I miss them so much...knowing them has opened up my mind and shown me how lucky I really am, one of them faced death so beautifully...she was 100% certain there was something after physical death, I'm not one of those jerks who tries to tear people down. I accept all beliefs, but... I'd secretly hoped if she was right, that they'd send me signs to show they're around...something for me to grasp onto, because now I'm scared. I don't want to become nothing, I don't want to accept I'll become nothing. But the logic side I've been raised with nulls out any hope I'm able to muster; I realise time only applies to humans, we're the only species to understand it's.........................

    Sorry if this is in the wrong place, it's to do with a fear of death...but I'm not sure if it belongs here or in lost souls. 

    Thank you x
    In my past I've tried to help individuals who came seeking answers.  What I've found, though, is that one's personal experiences and understanding often don't help someone else.  

    The notion that we all survive corporeal death is, for me, a simple one yet I readily admit I spent much time and effort making sense of some of it.  Perhaps others get to a similar point without the searching I had to do?  I don't know but if they do then that's great but I fancy many have to carry out their own research in whatever way works best for them.

    In your posting you've covered so much ground that responding to what you've said would take a lot of writing.  I much prefer breaking down subjects into manageable pieces and building from there. 

    What's the first and most important thing for you?
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    Re: Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  Violet on Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:53 am

    If it helps i was brought up in a household with similar opinions to those in your household,  I now run this forum to hopefully help people like I was and like you are now. 

    All  I can suggest is do your own research, read lots about mediums, the afterlife etc and make your own mind up, if you feel up to it find a reputable medium and go and have a sitting see what you think, one way I used to observe mediums working was in the spiritualist churches where they have demostrations of mediumship frequently, it doesnt cost a bean there is no commitment and it doesn't  matter what your beliefs are currently, they welcome all, go and watch them work and see what you think. I had my own personal proof of the afterlife....eventually, it was a lonely and bumpy and often quite scary journey back then, before internet and forums like this.
    IMO it is better to find your own way research, listen to others but only accept what makes sense to you, what feels right, you'll  know when it does.
    If nothing else I hope you overcome the fear of death, it can be extremely worrying to some.



    Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, it became a butterfly.

    jimrich
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    Go see a Medium

    Post  jimrich on Mon May 22, 2017 5:33 pm

    Ronaai wrote:I'm afraid I've been raised in a Stephen Hawking family where logic says there isn't anything after death. You shut down and that's all folks, as a kid it never bothered me...death wasn't an understandable topic, so who cares right? Now I'm at the age where I do understand...I've lost countless friends, around my age or younger, to cancer. 

    And I miss them so much...knowing them has opened up my mind and shown me how lucky I really am, one of them faced death so beautifully...she was 100% certain there was something after physical death, I'm not one of those jerks who tries to tear people down. I accept all beliefs, but... I'd secretly hoped if she was right, that they'd send me signs to show they're around...something for me to grasp onto, because now I'm scared. I don't want to become nothing, I don't want to accept I'll become nothing. But the logic side I've been raised with nulls out any hope I'm able to muster; I realise time only applies to humans, we're the only species to understand it's concepts and that's only because we wanted a way to keep track and measure...so in a sense, time doesn't exist but how is it possible for a living organism with only 100 or so years on this planet to contain a spiritual body that is eternal?

    I try watching Medium shows, but I recall quite vividly being told; "Mediums are scam artists of the worst kind. They're not only scamming others, they're also scamming themselves. They're so scared of death they've tricked their mind into believing they really can contact the dead, so when these poor emotionally unstable people come in, they will grasp onto the smallest piece of information even if it's miles from the truth of their loved one, and it's all lies." 

    I've also had it drilled into me that Souls/spirits do not exist, there's nothing inside a person aside brains and organs. The brain controls everything, dead = gone...one uncle believes consciousness is just a myth used to fuel religion, since to him religion = brainwashing power over people. Tell them they're God's real "Science has said God is real!" and you can control them to your whims..."life is meaningless, there is no God and you're dead a long time so live your life cause you only get one." is one of his favourite quotes.

    So I can't take it seriously...now I say "family" not all of my family feel this way thankfully, my mums side is a LOT more open minded, my Nan lost her husband, my Grandfather, when I was very small, my nan has always "spoken" to him, even now in the throws of dementia she still natters away to him, and my mum while accepting the logic, has told me she has heard his voice in her head a few times, mostly when she's scared or doesn't know what to do, so while realising it could just be longing for her dad, she says it does give her hope for more.

    I just don't know what to believe in anymore, everything around me; Science, Religion, Spirituality...it all feels like brainwashing. There are moments where I just want to break down crying.

    I don't want to never see my family again, of all my animals my dog is my absolute world...he can't fill my head with his ideals, just unconditional love; and I want to be with him always, it's not fair how we have these amazing animals, but they only get so long...and my mum, she's my world. We get on like chalk and cheese and I can't imagine a time without her without breaking down in tears, I can't imagine a time without any of my family...sure I don't exactly like their views, but they're my family. I'd be nothing without them.


    My Step-dad, his father "died" before passing away a few days later and apparently had an NDE...of course, that was dismissed as the drugs since another member of my family has a friend who was 'dead' for 20 minutes after a motorbike accident and described it as; "the light just went off. I wasn't there, no bright light, people waiting for me, nothing. The only reason I know it happened was because I woke up." 

    I also have a friend who stopped breathing as a child and remember absolutely nothing...but I don't know all the details about that and since they were so young, they're not 100% sure of it all either and never really wanted to ask about the happenings with their parents...

    So I just don't know anymore, I was hoping I'd be able to find someone to talk to on here...this isn't my first post; I posted about NDE's wondering why some people have them and others don't, but didn't really get much to go on with it. Grateful to those who replied, but I was hoping for a more in depth answer...

    Sorry if this is in the wrong place, it's to do with a fear of death...but I'm not sure if it belongs here or in lost souls. 

    Thank you x
    Re: I try watching Medium shows....
    Jim: I'd go visit an actual, inexpensive Medium in your neighborhood and, if there is something suspicious there, go see another one.  I've found most psychic/mediums to be honest and fair.  It helps to have a trusting, fearless attitude but don't be stupid and gullible if the Reader tries to "twist" more money out of you! 
    Re: I was hoping I'd be able to find someone to talk to on here...this isn't my first post

    Jim: (don't know how to quote yet!) I can only share my own personal experiences with you.  I personally know several dis-incarnates who are in the Afterlife now and they are just as alive and well as ever yet way happier over there since there is no: pain, fear, hate, sorrow, humiliation, etc. for them.  I no longer "believe" in spiritual things - I KNOW about them but could never prove it to anyone so, just open up and look around for sincere evidence of existence beyond physical death.  WE NEVER DIE!!!
    Good luck,
    jim

    mac
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    Re: Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  mac on Mon May 22, 2017 5:42 pm

    It's nearly a year since the original thread starter posted this thread.  She's not been back since.... Another example of a situation I raised recently for discussion elsewhere.

    jimrich
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    Close the threads

    Post  jimrich on Mon May 22, 2017 6:41 pm

    mac wrote:It's nearly a year since the original thread starter posted this thread.  She's not been back since....  Another example of a situation I raised recently for discussion elsewhere.
    LOL, if this is a problem for you, I'd petition the Admins to close all of those old threads.

    mac
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    Re: Struggling to get past the 'logic'

    Post  mac on Mon May 22, 2017 7:33 pm

    jimrich wrote:
    mac wrote:It's nearly a year since the original thread starter posted this thread.  She's not been back since....  Another example of a situation I raised recently for discussion elsewhere.
    LOL, if this is a problem for you, I'd petition the Admins to close all of those old threads.

    problem? LOL
    The author of this message was banned from the forum - See the message

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